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[Eatbrie]

I guess it all depends also on the weather. When I first told Holiday I kept all my posters in the garage without AC, he went crazy. Then I went to Florida over Christmas (where he lives) and realized how humid it is over there, very different from Southern California. I would never be able to keep my posters the way I do if I was living in Florida. Southern Cal is pretty dry, which I'm sure plays its part.

T.

[movieposterodyssey]

Hmmm...not sure how temerature effects acid in paper to be honest,Thierry.
Living in a rather humid climate as well I notice the usual rippling of the paper when it's super humid.That's all I have experienced so far.
I'm guessing that hot or cold the acid will still migrate like a virus.
Whether or not it thrives in one condition or not I don't know.
Dario will have to chime in here.


Damn! No kidding,Dale,that's an awesome deal! Wish I had the cash.

Anthony

[Bruce]

"I'm guessing that hot or cold the acid will still migrate like a virus."

That sounds reasonable, but long experience tells me that is not true at all.

I have seen first hand two unbelievable multi-million dollars collections discovered in Canada (cold and dry) and one unbelievable multi-million dollars collections discovered in Central America (hot and humid). All three were not protected from the elements in any way (just found loose), and sat that way for decades before they were discovered.

The posters from both Canadian collections were in remarkably good condition, with virtually no acid migration (no yellowing or brittleness) while the posters from the Central America collection had huge acid migration (much yellowing or brittleness).

To me, this is conclusive evidence that heat, humidity, light, and vermin (insects or rodents) are posters greatest enemy. Store them in a climate controlled place with no light source or flourescent lights, and no access for vermin, and you don't have to protect them in any way (and the fortune you save on bags, boxes, and boards can be spent on lots more posters.

Of course, if you live in a place like Florida or Hawaii, you have added problems, due to the heat and humidity. But you DO get to live in one of the nicest places in the world!

Bruce

[Eatbrie]

Very interesting. Everyone should read this.

T.

Oh, and thanks for proving Anthony wrong, Bruce. I like it.

[Game of Death]

Is it OK to shrink wrap linen backed 2 & 4sh's onto acid free boards.....framing them is too costly ?

Some of them are signed , bit worried about the autographs :/

[movieposterodyssey]

Bruce, on Apr 27 2008, 08:11 AM, said:

"I'm guessing that hot or cold the acid will still migrate like a virus."

That sounds reasonable, but long experience tells me that is not true at all.

I have seen first hand two unbelievable multi-million dollars collections discovered in Canada (cold and dry) and one unbelievable multi-million dollars collections discovered in Central America (hot and humid). All three were not protected from the elements in any way (just found loose), and sat that way for decades before they were discovered.

The posters from both Canadian collections were in remarkably good condition, with virtually no acid migration (no yellowing or brittleness) while the posters from the Central America collection had huge acid migration (much yellowing or brittleness).

To me, this is conclusive evidence that heat, humidity, light, and vermin (insects or rodents) are posters greatest enemy. Store them in a climate controlled place with no light source or flourescent lights, and no access for vermin, and you don't have to protect them in any way (and the fortune you save on bags, boxes, and boards can be spent on lots more posters.

Of course, if you live in a place like Florida or Hawaii, you have added problems, due to the heat and humidity. But you DO get to live in one of the nicest places in the world!

Bruce

Well hold on now,before Thierry gets too happy, were these 'country of origin' posters,Bruce?
The paper they use down their is lower grade.Would make sense it would be more susceptible to acid migration.
What about newspapers?? They suffer acid migration and breakdown equally whether it's hot or cold temperatures.
The defense rests.

Help,Dario!


ooohh...don't know about the signatures,Game of Death.Could be a problem there.Not sure.

Anthony

[Eatbrie]

Anthony,

Why do you always have to push the envelope? Why can't you just admit that you don't know?

I, Anthony (Last Name) admit that I am pulling a lot of sh!t out of my ass and swear to listen to my elders (more knowledgeable) poster collectors (Thierry) in the future.

Sign it!!!!


SIGN IT!!!

[ddilts]

Agree completely on this one, dark, cool and humidity around the 40% range is recommended levels. Higher promotes mildew, lower and you start to dry out and get brittle paper.

[movieposterodyssey]

Dude,I stayed at Holiday Inn express last night,I know stuff.


No seriously,keep it down,the other members don't know I make stuff up.

[Eatbrie]

Dude, seriously, you're on a roll. In 2 posts, you mentioned my two favorite forum members. Keep it up. I'm in Phoenix right now, celebrating the Suns only victory. Bunch of wonkers!

T.

[Bruce]

"were these 'country of origin' posters,Bruce? The paper they use down their is lower grade.Would make sense it would be more susceptible to acid migration."

Good try! But in all three cases I was talking about U.S. one-sheets and lobby cards, and many thousands of each, many from the exact same years.

The paper DOES have acid in it. But it is clearly the enviroment the paper is in that TRIGGERS the release of the acid, and its harmful effects.

Bruce

[movieposterodyssey]

haha...thought you might like that one name drop.
That game took me for a loop.Didn't expect the Spurs not to show up.It will be over soon enough though.
That Laker game was hilarious.Carmello and AI couldn't hit a damn thing.Not that ever had a chance in the series anyway.


Dale's post certified what I was guessing.
No matter what temperature,acid is ready to strike and bite a one sheet in the ass.

Anthony

[vintagemovieart]

Climate plays a major part in deterioration or preservation. I know Bruce is talking about the the famous "Royal Theater Collection" in Canada. It was in such great shape when discovered due to the storage conditions. I'm not familiar with the Mexican collection, but if it was all US paper as well, as Bruce points out it gives you an idea what different climates can do to paper.

Best,

dario.

[Eatbrie]

Take that, Anthony!

http://www.moviepost...tyle_emoticons/default/jason2.gif

[Bruce]

"I know Bruce is talking about the the famous "Royal Theater Collection" in Canada"

That is one. The other Canadian one was bigger and better (it is where the Frankenstein teaser one sheet came from!), but did not receive publicity.

The Central American collection was huge in numbers, and included some never before seen early 1930s 3-sheets and 6-sheets.

Keep posters away from heat, light, humidity and vermin, and they will stay fine.

Bruce

[Bruce]

The Royal Theater Collection discovery is a great story! By the time Jim Dietz got there, only a fragment of the original find remained. There was so much double-dealing, stealing and lying involved in this story that I know the entire story has never been told, but a bunch of stuff has been written and it is well worth seeking out.

If I live long enough, I will tell the entire story (what I know of it, around 95%), but I wouldn't do so until the main people involved have passed on, so I doubt I will live long enough!

As to the other Canadian find, I sold almost all of it through my auctions, and I will tell that story someday (very little of that has even been told).

Bruce

[wonkabars7]

Very interesting.

Articles or other info would be great.

[movieposterodyssey]

carson_cochren, on Apr 28 2008, 08:17 AM, said:

All winking emoticons and covering up bad guesswork aside, long term storage is well worth being clear about.

Hold up,we were having a discussion about it,I think everything was quite clear.
I really don't think my guess was that bad,acid is like a virus,makes sense it would destroy paper in all temperatures.
That was my best guess...I was wrong.
I had no idea climates in places like California,Arizona,Canada..ect, completely protected paper from acid without any use of protective materials.

Ya learn something new everyday.
Thanks everybody for the schooling.It's an interesting subject.


You win this round,Thierry.


Anthony

[vintagemovieart]

Ok, so there is a bit of a misunderstanding. Climates good or bad or even perfect wont protect a poster from acid. All it takes for a poster that is stored in a perfectly climate controlled room, is contact with cardboard or even a wood flat file cabinet and you will have acid migration.

A cool dark and dry poster cache found in Canada, will most likely be in much better shape than a collection found in?? a sweltering, hot, humid critter infested back room south of the border.

Having said that, please note that Pollutants contribute heavily to the deterioration of Paper. The two major types of pollutants are gases and particulates.

Gaseous contaminants---especially sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, peroxides, and ozone---catalyze harmful chemical reactions that lead to the formation of acid in paper. Paper becomes discolored and brittle.
Particulates---especially soot---abrade, soil, and disfigure materials.

Valuable paper items should be stored at relative humidity between 45 and 50% and at temperatures between 18 and 20?C.

Best,

dario.

PS: Someone mentioned Mylar as costly crap along with some other crap. Kindly, I must say Mylar is actually a very very good product. I would like to recommend everyone to buy a roll of Mylar. Cut as you like and line your drawers, boxes and even the inside of you tubes.